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Well it all sorta started standard like...

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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Mon 22 Apr 2013, 18:58

due to the design of the headers being a 4 into 1 I had to be mindful of oil filter clearance and also ensuring the collector fitted underneath the engine and not touch the fairing, I had to remove the front V panel to allow clearance but nothing major needed, I will revisit this to see if I can make something to fill the gap but hey it's less weight and better airflow.

and a gratuitous finished shot because I like it Very Happy
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Sat 18 May 2013, 19:16

Well the last instalment was all about the go now is all about some stoppage


Why is it all bloody brake discs have gold centres? I found some brake discs
which met my specification, I didn't want them made from stamped sheet but
wanted them manufactured from billet as the grain structure is far superior and
resistance to warping is greatly reduced and they had aluminium billet centres
anodised black (result!!!).

Ordered front and rear and chose Ferodo sintered pads as I have always had
very good results with this brand of pad, so it will be interesting to see how
they perform with these discs.

So this is what I started with, standard Nissin discs



oh and to help lift the front up I finally finished making my front paddock
stand, only took my a year and a half



Wheel off

I took the opportunity to do a deep clean on the front wheel as it is a
bugger to clean it without being able to rotate (that now won't be an issue any
more with the new front stand woohoo!!!)



New discs on and replaced the fasteners with some more Titanium bolts (I
really need help lol)



my pads of choice



and fitted



and swapped the rear disc out to match the front and used the same pad
compound also



I also bought some high temp gold foil to start affixing it to heat prone
areas for better heat deflection and stop heat transfer.

first 2 pieces done are the heat shields which go over the R1 cans under the
seat unit





Didn't take a pic with it fitted as you cannot see the foil once fitted but I
know it's there, when I get a chance I will remove the cans and do the undertray
area as well which will hopefully look good
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Tue 21 May 2013, 19:07

time for a bit of MotoGP bling, it could cause
endless debate as to whether they are needed or not, it's my bike and I like
it.
It arrived in fantastic time from Hong Kong, I doubt I could have got it
any quicker and for the same money as anywhere in the UK, it is really nicely
made and comes with a comprehensive bag of bits so you can tailor it to your
bike.
My only grumble was the bit required to locate in the bar end weight
was made of a hard rubber, would have preferred it made from aluminium so with a
few measurements and a scrap lump of ally I made one in my lunchbreak... we
shall call it a widget...

and when I got home it all got built up and set

Very happy bunny!!!
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Mon 27 May 2013, 10:43

I never really felt the love of the blue dials,
didn't really go with the scheme of the bike, so out with the blue, we now have
yellow.


in
other news I am having made for me a front and rear spindle set in Titanium (I
did say I have issues), modelled them off the original items then took more
weight out where possible and aesthetically tweaked the designs. Not cheap but
worth every penny as now it will not be the awful crumbly chrome bits poking
out. I am remaking the wheel spacers in 7075 aluminium, again taking weight out
of them, and will hard anodise. Just got to wait 6 weeks for the spindles......
are they done yet?
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by lambchops on Mon 27 May 2013, 12:35

how much are the spindles costing if you dont mind me asking, Presume your having them made?
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by clive1286 on Mon 27 May 2013, 14:24

Where did you get the yellow dials from, could see them on mine
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Mon 27 May 2013, 17:50

lambchops wrote:how much are the spindles costing if you dont mind me asking, Presume your having them made?
Dude, for you... of course I don't mind you asking
the front is £200 and the rear is £275 and yes I am having them made by a guy who knows more about Titanium than I could ever hope to know. The spacers I am making myself, but he quoted £100 for them out of 7075. He also makes the most exquisite nuts and things for them but I already own the fixings from Probolt.
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Mon 27 May 2013, 17:52

clive1286 wrote:Where did you get the yellow dials from, could see them on mine
good old ebay
the seller was from Quebec and delivery came quite quickly. Just remember to specify MPH as standard comes as KM/H, don't ask how I know this
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by clive1286 on Mon 27 May 2013, 18:28

Any chance you could post the link? Thanks
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Mon 27 May 2013, 19:44

clive1286 wrote:Any chance you could post the link? Thanks

bloody hell, you'll want me to buy them for you next...

sure here's the link
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/270482092306?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649

these are the KM/H though. I am waiting for a response as to whether I can have it in MPH, the blue ones were from him and they are MPH so shouldn't be an issue
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by clive1286 on Mon 27 May 2013, 20:00

89forever wrote:
clive1286 wrote:Any chance you could post the link? Thanks

bloody hell, you'll want me to buy them for you next...

sure here's the link
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/270482092306?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649

these are the KM/H though. I am waiting for a response as to whether I can have it in MPH, the blue ones were from him and they are MPH so shouldn't be an issue
Now there's a thought!!!! no won't push my luck.
cheers for the link, i was searching for speedo dials, & getting nowhere
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Mon 27 May 2013, 21:00

clive1286 wrote:
Now there's a thought!!!! no won't push my luck.
cheers for the link, i was searching for speedo dials, & getting nowhere

whilst I would gladly offer I think the cost of my added commission may make you fall over...
oh and you're welcome
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by silverback on Wed 29 May 2013, 13:04

Isn't it strange how many a modified back end is an R1 unit

As my bike is graphite grey, I have no problem with your colour Smile unlike cabbie LOL

I would advise adding some black exhaust wrap around the exhaust or a shield next to your right leg as it's going to get warm there '08 R1 = hot leg and warm bum'.
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Sat 08 Jun 2013, 17:00

silverback wrote:
I would advise adding some black exhaust wrap around the exhaust or a shield next to your right leg as it's going to get warm there '08 R1 = hot leg and warm bum'.

Thanks for the heads up but the exhaust route doesn't follow exactly like an R1, the pipe is well within the swingarm and is away from my leg... funnily enough this was an area that I did check as whilst it's nice being warm, it's not sooooo nice being on fire

and onto today's update

well yesterday was Dyno day...
Had one those gut feelings that it may not go smoothly, spent the previous weekend removing the new exhaust to ensure everything was ok with it and reseal all the joints, one had a slight leak. Started it up and you know when you think you hear something, well I thought I heard a very very slight knock. Dismissed it and used and abused the bike as per normal week.
Finished work early on Friday and got to the Dyno shop... very experienced guy, trust him with his work.
Gets the bike onto the rollers and hooks her up, comments on who made the exhaust etc (chest is puffed out at this stage hahaha)
So we go for base line settings, was way rich across the rev range and then the oil light flickers...

Turn everything off, check oil level (already did fluids and final checks the night before so I knew all was good), level was still where it should be.
Ran up again and listened... yup sounds it more a bit more rattly in the bottom end lol

So, it's rebuild time, woohoo....

As a note, just before we shut her down she was making good power despite the over fuelling, saw a good 120bhp way below peak power, so the exhaust theory was sound!!!
So a full strip down and measure, anything worn will be replaced. Crank will be lightened as will the flywheel. Trying to find stronger lighter rods and all moving parts will be superfinished for friction reduction and more power.
Head is of course going to be flowed, I have a local lad who has a flow bench and does BSB stuff, soo with beer tokens in hand he'll give me some head affraid
I am chucking the carbs at my dyno guy as he wants to rebuild them, so never one to argue he'll have them in the week.
Cases will be vapour blasted and hopefully get her looking a bit newer lol...
Hopefully cylinders and pistons will escape with a rehone and new rings but time will tell...
Just a shame I didn't get a true baseline reading for all future mods
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by lambchops on Sat 08 Jun 2013, 22:21

Oh no bummer :( sounds like she's coming back bigger and better though! Can see some titanium rods going in haha. The place which balance my rods and crank were good and priced reasonably.
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Sun 09 Jun 2013, 09:17

lambchops wrote:Oh no bummer :( sounds like she's coming back bigger and better though! Can see some titanium rods going in haha. The place which balance my rods and crank were good and priced reasonably.
You know LC I was thinking exactly the same thing but can I find any available? nope and so far I have only found these worthy of inclusion
http://www.faliconcranks.com/2pc.html

but if anyone knows of anything Ti then I'm all ears

Who did you use for the balancing? I am planning on using a guy who does BSB stuff and comes highly recommended.
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by masterblader on Sun 09 Jun 2013, 11:31

What a bummer. Check your PM 89
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Sun 09 Jun 2013, 18:30

masterblader wrote:What a bummer. Check your PM 89
yeah shit happens but am always upbeat about these things, it isn't the 1st engine to go bang and won't be the last lol. Always looking for the next weak link
PM's checked and appreciated, so hugs n kisses all round
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by lambchops on Sun 09 Jun 2013, 19:55

Did Mique sort you out with the contact details?
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by Tone on Sun 09 Jun 2013, 20:39

89forever wrote:

Who did you use for the balancing? I am planning on using a guy who does BSB stuff and comes highly recommended.

I used a Chris Appleby (Appleby Engineering) to do my crank. He managed to remove just under 1.5 kg off my crank and weight matched all the rods as well.

Have you come accross this guy in your quest for all things titanium?

http://www.ti64.co.uk/
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Sun 09 Jun 2013, 21:53

[quote="Tone"]
89forever wrote:
Have you come accross this guy in your quest for all things titanium?

http://www.ti64.co.uk/

Pete, yup absolute legend... have you looked at his blog? porn at it's best and a true old school engineer, doing things properly...
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Sun 09 Jun 2013, 21:54

lambchops wrote:Did Mique sort you out with the contact details?

Mique = legend and a true gent
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by lambchops on Mon 10 Jun 2013, 09:13

Wow those titanium parts are very very nice!! £280 for a wheel spindle though bit out of my price range No
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Mon 10 Jun 2013, 19:36

lambchops wrote:Wow those titanium parts are very very nice!! £280 for a wheel spindle though bit out of my price range No
nah, just have to change priorities dude... the don't need to eat for a week or 2
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Sat 29 Jun 2013, 17:20

So after a hour here

I ended up with a few hours here

Which led to my discovery of the mains having let go, 1 out of the 5 was ok the other 4 the white metal had failed, which led to a scrap crank but the cases where luckily ok, well until the next paragraph.

Due to the metal lovingly working it's way around with the oil the bores are scored and the pistons are dead. So, options? Honda list a 0.25mm oversize piston, EVERYBODY tells me the bores cannot be machined as they are all manner of things, well I can categorically state they where wrong.
The version of blade before the RRW/RRX had steel liners which can be machined normally (I think Honda list 2 oversizes?) and the versions after the RRW/RRX are indeed Nikasil plated but the RRW/RRX is unique, they have a type of ceramic cylinder liner which is cast in as the blocks are made and they have the option of being rebored once, and once only.
Hence why Honda list a piston 0.25mm oversize.
Great I thought, nip down to Honda and buy 4 pistons and rings sets... I scoured the earth and found 2 in South Africa and luckily 2 in the UK (they had 3 on the shelf, who buys 1 bloody piston?)
So, at the mo the cases are away being Vapour blasted to get them clean, then I can bore the cylinders to suit the new pistons.
But I have been busy with other stuff  eyebrow 
You should all know by now I like things to be light? well engine internals are no different.
Take 2 standard cam sprockets and put them on a diet

I have slotted the mounting holes so I can dial the cams in more accurately than what standard markings allow.
I am keeping with standard cams as I prefer the profile to suit some other mods and will help greatly.
Cams got a skim on the lathe to remove some casting bobs (kindly nicked the idea from LC's engine build)

and prior to statically balancing the rods and new pistons and then prior to sending everything away for dynamically balancing I put the crank on a little diet this morning on a spare lathe. Nothing drastic or severe as I don't want to harm torque but I do want to aid parasitic loss through the oil and reduce mass a bit, the crank webs went from this

to this

making the crank look like this

I weighed the stock crank on Friday and found it to weigh 8.55kgs, so after I have finished polishing the webs on Monday ran out of time today) I'll see what weight it's lost.
In other news the head is off being flowbenched by I guy who does BSB heads, I trust his work and as I don't have access to use a flowbench anymore needs must.
That's it for now.......
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Sat 27 Jul 2013, 12:10

lots been happening behind the scenes but my Ti fetish has been growing courtesy of www.ti64.co.uk Pete, is an absolute legend, one man, one machine (well maybe 2, maybe 3???) and the love of all things lightweight and bike related, if you have a spare day or 2 take a look at his blog for all the jewels he has made (have the tissues to hand.
By his own admission he is not quick but by god is the boy good at what he does and the fact he is a true honest gent goes a long way. The world needs more of people like him.
I drew up my spindles (axles) in CAD and we spoke about the project, strength and weight being the main criteria, Pete suggested a few tweaks and the files where tweaked to suit. So with a green light given and costs agreed. I waited patiently (then the engine shit itself but more on that update later
True to his word the spindles (axles) where completed in 6 weeks as quoted and then they arrived



the above pics borrowed from Pete's blog for reference.
They are too good to fit and oh my god they weigh nothing... (all weights are in grams for the metrics amongst us)

original rear spindle

new Ti rear spindle

original front spindle

new Ti front spindle
the difference is amazing
 
and for reference the Ti rear nut and front bolt weights

old bolt

New Ti bolt
and didn't have my old rear nut to hand as this got replaced a while ago but the Ti one is lighter I am sure lol

Ti rear nut
Just to note Pete didn't make the nut and bolt as I had already purchased those (nut from ProBolt and the bolt an ebay special) but he is more than capable (he suggested a lighter alternative than Ti which had I not already had these I would have gone with).
So having removed these for weighing I have now found other bits to get remade, so they have been sent for fabrication...
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Sat 27 Jul 2013, 12:48

So, where is the engine project at?

To be honest it has been a hassle. Hindsight is a wonderful thing and had I known now it would have been far far cheaper to stick the most modern variant 'blade lump in and would have been rolling by now but we make our bed, so one must lie in it. Everyday is a learning curve.

Oversize OE pistons where a nightmare to source but found 4.

It shocked me on the cost of some (sod that, ALL) of the UK OE Honda prices, so have hunted around the globe (mostly the USA, cheers Very Happy ) for cost effectiveness as whilst in there anything of doubt has been replaced.

Then onto the machining of the bores, remember that they are a special ceramic? yup nobody had the equipment or know how on what to do with them. I found a source from HRC UK who suggest I speak to a guy, who said I should speak to a guy, who said I should speak.... (this was a loooong day hahaha) but eventually I found a company who (a) had the experience, (b) had the equipment, and (c) wanted to undertake the project.

So as of today the cylinder case and pistons are with this company (www.hone-all.co.uk) for the treatment and on the plus side they are doing a process called plateau honing which means there is zero need to break the engine in but then I have always ran engines in hard as I have had far better results with ring/cylinder sealing this way (this isn't to start a debate on the subject, it's my method and it works for me, everyone has their own way and I respect that).

Once the cylinder and pistons are returned I an send the rotating mass off for dynamically balancing and then the rebuild begins.

Whilst hunting for someone to machine the case I weighed the new pistons and was happy to see they where all within 1gram of each other, which is great considering these are all from different batches of manufacture and are massed produced (reality speaking). So a little time and patience had them all with 0.02grams which is much better Smile

The same treatment has been done to the rods.

I had all the cases vapour blasted and it is kinder and less abrasive. I used a local lad to me who did a stunning job for a very reasonable cost and his details are http://vapour-blasting.com/

No pics as yet but it is slowly coming on. Once built and in I will give a detailed break down of costs for those that are interested and yes so far I could have bought another RRW for the money in this engine but it will be better than new and (hopefully) more powerful and give me many miles of smiles...
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by Tone on Sat 27 Jul 2013, 23:34

Cracking job, you will certainly notice the difference in the crank and how quick the motor spins up.

Are you planning any changes to the wheels/brakes?

The ISR brakes are unbelievable and fantastically light to boot.

This is my rear brake caliper, (with pads its 272g)

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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by lambchops on Sun 28 Jul 2013, 07:56

Wow great read 89 love those spindles truly amazing quality and so light! Wish I could afford some myself.. One day maybe when the numbers come up Smile
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Re: Well it all sorta started standard like...

Post by 89forever on Sun 28 Jul 2013, 09:32

Tone wrote:Cracking job, you will certainly notice the difference in the crank and how quick the motor spins up.

Are you planning any changes to the wheels/brakes?

The ISR brakes are unbelievable and fantastically light to boot.

This is my rear brake caliper, (with pads its 272g)

Thank you Tone, I hope the difference will be felt, can't do it any harm. There was so much more meat to be able to be removed but this is a daily bike not a race one and I want some longevity.
I would love a set of carbon wheels but whilst she is a daily ride that may not be practical unless someone can convince me otherwise?
Brakes will be address at some point in the future. I like the look of the ISR stuff but couldn't help but want to refinish them black lol
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